Re: Engineering Certifications

"Bernie" <Bernie@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
news:j367c0lhpbel5koh5ugbur77o8i56vrjpc@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Sun, 6 Jun 2004 12:20:59 -0700, "ec" <no@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Bernie" <Bernie@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
> >news:o4vsb01hksed3oat9ocoqm434n59p9gf69@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> On Wed, 02 Jun 2004 21:43:50 GMT, "AT" <torgny@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> >"Bernie" <Bernie@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote in message
> >> >news:6qrrb0labbs24i0b473f0h40ajit260u3d@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >> >> Quick question.  Do you mean real engineers, psuedo-engineers (who
> >> >> arguably do perform *some* engineering tasks but are not certified
by
> >> >> state government as "engineers"), or the completely fake engineers
who
> >> >> make a joke out of the real term "engineer" by attaching it to
people
> >> >> who pass silly Prometric exams?
> >> >>
> >> >> --Bernie
> >> >
> >> >Engineer is a Job Title! Meaning if you have the job as an engineer
then
> >you
> >> >are an engineer!
> >>
> >> Correction.  Today it is a job title and a professional degree which
> >> also has governmental controls (e.g. state board certification etc.).
> >> It used to only be the latter.  The title engineer has been so
> >> cheapened by cheesy jobs and lame vendor certifications that adopted
> >> that title to grant an automatic (and cheaply bought I might add)
> >> elevation in status.
> >>
> >> So ten years from now when "engineer" no longer carries even the
> >> pitiful status it retains has today, are we going work the word
> >> "doctor" into our titles to get a further cheaply bought elevation?
> >> I'm a "network doctor" (not an MD).... scratch that, I'm a "senior
> >> network doctor."  Oops now that everyone is calling themselves a
> >> senior network doctor, I am now a "level three senior network
doctor."
> >>
> >> Maybe after that we will start calling ourselves scientists or
lawyers
> >> etc.
> >>
> >> See how ridiculous that is?  It is a slippery slope when you start
> >> cheapening titles that used to mean something.
> >>
> >> >On the other hand you can have an education as an engineer
> >> >but not have a job as an engineer. In this case I would not consider
you
> >as
> >> >an engineer.
> >>
> >> But what does it matter what you consider someone if the state board
> >> considers someone a civil engineer, electrical engineer, etc?
> >>
> >> >Complicated? Could be, but that's life!
> >> >
> >> >The original question is too wide to even try to answer.
> >>
> >> Yes it is!  That was partly my point.
> >>
> >> --Bernie
> >
> >Oh, and the CCIE is a "cheesy" cert right?
>
> E stands for Expert in case you weren't aware, lol.
>
> >Those guys aren't real engineers,
>
> No they aren't.  I'll leave it to you to try to make the case that
> they are.
>
> >right? Whats your CCIE number Bernie? It's so easy and cheesy to get,
you
> >must have gotten one as they ARE valuable.
>
> See above.
>
> --Bernie

My main point is:

If you do the job, you get the title.

Take John Carmack for example. He is the found and lead programmer for iD
software. ( Doom, Quake, etc ). He writes the 3D engines HIMSELF, and has
no
degree. He is arguably the best programmer in the world in his field. Can
he
not call himself a software engineer? Since he has no degree? Is he a
software tech, even though he puts all others in field with degrees to
shame? He is alos building a real rocket right now, competing for that 10
million dollar prize. I guess he can't call himself a rocket scientest
either, even though his self learned skills in the field make him just as
trained as one. Not everyone requires a professor.