Werner <whetzner@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>On May 5, 11:49 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj...@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> wrote:
>> >Teachers have tenure. Most people don't.
>>
>> They call them "contracts". Those people who negotiate contracts have
>> whatever protections are built into them.
>
>I know. Some contracts are more equal than others.
Perhaps if your profession unionized you'd be able to get a better
contract.
>> Public school "tenure" is pretty minimal protection.
>
>I keep reading that it is very expensive to sack a tenured teacher.
For what reason?
If one has well-do***ented justification, it isn't expensive at all.
If it is school politics, then it indeed will likely be expensive.
>> >Teachers have lots of things that many other people don't get.
>>
>> Yeah. The chance to pay for the supplies needed to do their job out
>> of their own pocket when the school district doesn't budget enough.
>> The op****tunity to get among the lowest starting salary of any
>> profession that requires a 5 year degree program in order to get in
>> the front door.
>
>Are you one of them?
Nope. I couldn't survive in a classroom, and I doubt that you could
either.
>Give us a break! Last time I checked teachers in my district were
averaging about $65K
How many years experience? Some districts have had trouble getting
new young teachers and are heavily weighted towards teachers with
20-30 years experience. Of course they are expensive.
http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos069.htm
Median starting salary is more like $32K, with the median salary
around $48K. The top 10% average around $70K. Nobody gets rich on a
teacher's salary.
BTW, starting salary for computer programmers these days is $50K per
year, with median earnings of $65K. You need less education to be a
programmer than a teacher.
http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos110.htm
If they become a system engineer, the median goes up to $80,000, with
10% making more than $125K.
If they pay teachers less, they go into industry and make more money.
>plus generous benefits for a 5 or 6 hour day
That is where you are wrong. They are IN CLASS for 6 hours a day. But
then there are school meetings, conferences with parents, grading
papers, and preparing for future cl***** (some schools require
do***ented lesson plans, in case the teacher is sick and needs a
substitute). There are plenty of teachers who put in 10-12 hour days.
>and lots of vacation.
Nope. They typically have a 10 month contract. They aren't paid for
the summer. If they teach summer school, then they get a little more
money, but not a lot. Meanwhile they are required to take courses to
maintain their certification, usually at their own expense.
>> >Why not have a law permitting vouchers that is equally available to
>> >all?
>>
>> Because "we the people" don't want one.
>
>It would be more correct to assert that teachers don't want them.
The people don't want them either. Vouchers regularly get voted down.
>> Vouchers on the ballot have
>> been voted down dozens of times in numerous jurisdictions.
>>
>> Why should we? It gets us nothing that we don't already have.
>
>We have expensive and lousy schools. Why does that not bother you?
Because I know that you are wrong. Our schools are cheap compared to
quality private schools, and our schools are good. Sometimes our
students aren't as good as the schools that they attend.
Much of the cost of the public schools goes for things like
trans****tation and school lunches, and thus shouldn't be counted in
the *education* cost at all. Around a quarter of most school budgets
go for special education for about 10% of the students, which is
extremely expensive because Federal Law requires it to be
individualized according to what the student needs. The private
schools can simply reject those special ed students and save the
money. Or they can take the students and force the public schools to
pay for the special education.
>> I have no interest in paying for someone to go to religious school. I
>> got a good public school education and so did my kids. Those who want
>> something else can find the money themselves.
>
>I have no interest in paying for expensive lousy schools.
You have a choice. I'm sure there are countries where you wouldn't
have to. We won't miss you.
lojbab
Bob LeChevalier - artificial linguist; genealogist
lojbab@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Lojban language www.lojban.org
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